Fw: Hey Alan, Read & Respond Please ...
David Lee Ronie@InfoAVE.net
Sun, 14 Feb 1999 22:40:07 -0500 (00919071607, 012a01be5894$e2fa2140$625c74cc@ronies)
Hi Group!
Here is another fine example of christian "love". Notice how this
apologist reasons with someone he disagrees with...
----- Original Message -----
From: Hunter Int. <cleaner@starnetinc.com>
Newsgroups: alt.religion.christian.biblestudy
Sent: Sunday, February 14, 1999 5:11 PM
Subject: Hey Alan, Read & Respond Please ...
Alan (the skeptic ) wrote:
>>In your post you said you would always be here (or hear as Ben
>>says) to defend the bible.
Apologist writes:
>Yes, of course. What part of...
>
>1 Peter 3:15
>"But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an
>ANSWER (Apology!) to every man that asketh you a reason of the hope that is
>in you with meekness and fear:"
>
>...didn't you understand over the last week I've been posting it...?
>
>Now listen up boyo, here's some definitions of 'apology'...
>
>Strong's definition...
>
>627 apologia (ap-ol-og-ee'-ah);
>from the same as 626; a plea ("apology"):
>KJV-- answer (forself), clearing ofself, DEFENSE.
>
>Thayer's definition...
>
>627 apologia-
>1) verbal DEFENSE, speech in DEFENSE
>2) a reasoned statement or an argument
>
>Notice how the great Apostle declares that what I am here doing is exactly
>what God Almighty would have me do. And this presents a problem for you
and
>that sin racked buddy of yours Peter M.
>
>Why is that...?
Alan writes:
>>Why does the bible need defending?
Apologist responds:
>Because idiots like you try to destroy it's integrity through mindless acts
>of self destruction and selfishness. And that's just for starters. How
>about because idiots like you have the desire to destroy the weaker
>believer's foundation before it can take? How many more reasons would you
>like?
>
>Alan, you're a moron, and that alone is reason enough for the defense I
will
>put up against you, and for God's Word. But, if I had NO OTHER reason,
this
>would do just fine...
>
>2 Timothy 4:3-5
>3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but
after
>their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching
ears;
>4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned
>unto fables.
>5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an
>evangelist, MAKE FULL PROOF of thy ministry.
>
>...and...
>
>Acts 20:29-31
>29 For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in
>among you, not sparing the flock.
>30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to
>draw away disciples after them.
>31 Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased
>not to warn every one night and day with tears.
>
>These are plenty enough reasons for me to defend what guys like you will
>always be spewing.
>
>Man, I pray that someday you will be saved, and on that day, you will
>remember these things you've said and you'll be in awe at the power of the
>sin nature residing in your flesh. That day will be a day that will rank
>higher than anything you've ever experienced in your entire life. You will
>not even be able to understand how you could have said these things here
for
>so long now.
>
>And on that day, you will return here to tell us of it, and we WILL greet
>you with open arms and wish that where ever you are we could be there to
>experience the joy in knowing Christ, and Him crucified.
DAVE writes:
Gosh, after his display of christian love can you imagine wanting to be
greeted with open arms by him?
Apologist continues:
I pray that day
>will not be long in forthcoming.
Alan (skeptic) writes:
>>Why can't people recognize it as the
>>(alleged) "Word of God"?
Apologist responds:
>That's a stupid question to begin with. 'IF' you really meant the
'alleged'
>Word of God, then your answer is simple. They can! Even you do this. You
>are 'trying' to figure out what, if anything, God has said through the
>Bible, therefore it already is the 'alleged' Word of God by very
definition.
>
>I'll bet that went 'swooosh' right over you.
>
>On the other hand, it CAN, and IS recognized as the Word of God by those
who
>have forsaken their sins by asking for God's mercy through Christ on
>Calvary. I assure you, that is the quickest way to find out 'if' the Bible
>is of God.
>
>Become a 'new creature' (2 Corinthians 5:17, Galatians 6:15), and 'new man'
>(Ephesians 2:15, Colossians 3:10), by being Saved, then you WILL know that
>this Book is of Almighty God Himself.
Alan :
>>If I quote the bible as saying GOD ORDERS THE KILLKING OF LITTLE
>>CHILDREN (Ezek. 9:6) why can't you just say, Yes, this is how God is,
>>this is my God and I love him for this kindness of killing little
>>children.
Apologist responds:
>See, you're wrong again. I MOST definitely 'could' say that, BUT, I
>wouldn't need to say that, I already know the answer to your latest
example.
>
>The problem is, has been, and will remain, that YOU do not understand how
>God views you and humanity OUTSIDE of Christ. You just don't get it.
>
>You think that someday Alan is going to get a 'hearing' in front of God and
>point his stupid little finger in God's face and blame God for all the
>problems Alan had with the Bible.
>
>Well let me tell you something, here's what's going to happen should you
>ever get to that grave state!
>
>You're going to be dragged kicking and screaming from a cell full of other
>men like you by an 'Angel Private Third Class' that will make anything
>Steven Spielberg ever created look like Barney. Then you are going to be
>placed in front of an Almighty Triune Godhead who will want to know what
>your idiotic reason was for bashing His Word, and those who trusted it,
>during your pathetic lifetime. Now, EVEN if you 'could' answer, well, you
>won't be able to, because your fear and anguish will be so great and
>terrible that your tongue will have finally shriveled away into
nothingness,
>your throat will be so knotted that even should 'air' be necessary by then,
>it will be unavailable at that moment, and you will not be able to offer a
>word up in your own defense.
>
>Then, as sure as God made little green apples, you are GOING to finally
pray
>to God that you still had the ability to make the 'apology' that at this
>very moment you and Peter-troll laugh at so often.
>
>Yeah, that about sums it up. Still laughing...?
DAVE
This guy posts frequently to christian.biblestudy and envisions himself
as an able defender of the faith.
Alan (skeptic) writes:
>>When Craig quotes verses that say Jesus died for me, you are
>>right there to say, listen to this verse, its the truth, this is what
>>God wants you to know, this is my God and this is how he is.
Apologist:
>Yes, I know you have read over and over this passage, as I post it often
for
>you...
>
>Acts 16:30-31
>30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
>31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be
saved,
>and thy house.
>
>Alan, for your sake, it really IS that easy.
Alan (skeptic):
>>Why the double standard?
Apologist:
>I have NEVER used a double standard here. Ever. I answer everything when
>addressed, and do so using the revealed Word of God when it's a Scriptural
>issue.
Alan:
>>If Craig quotes something from the Bible he loves God. When I quote
>>something from the Bible I hate God.
Apologist:
>Yes, you do indeed appear to hate God, as you deny that He even has the
>ability to say what He means, mean what He says, and keep it intact for us
>to read and understand. Yes, you give God Almighty ZERO credit, what other
>conclusion can we come to...?
>
>Alan, YOU have never EVER, said a kind word about God, and in fact, one of
>your long standing blithering threads challenged anyone here to 'find'
>something 'good' God ever did!
>
>What do you expect in return? You are an insincere person, and when you
get
>treated like one you act like it's a 'big shock' or something!
Alan:
>>When Craig quotes the Bible its the truth and stands on its own.
Apologist:
>If Craig posts accurately, (and I have seen that he does), then it's not
him
>that is right, it's God Almighty. So yes, I agree with what you said.
Alan:
>>When I quote the bible, I am lying and my lies need a 20 to 30 page
>response so
>>that no one will misunderstand the verse.
Apologist:
>No sir, no one EVER said that, and you know it. It's not your 'quoting'
>that has us in fits here, it's your CONCLUSIONS that get our attention.
>
>It's you lack of attention to detail. It's your lack of connections to
>other Scriptures. It's your lack of desire to truly learn anything. It's
>your lack of 'Rightly Dividing'. It's your lack of respect for what others
>already hold dear.
>
>I could go on, but is it necessary...?
Alan:
>>Dave this is a clear case of playing favorites.
Apologist:
>Yes, I'll admit it. God plays favorites. God loves Israel, and He will do
>EVERYTHING He promised with Israel, regardless of what they do in the
>meantime. And yes, God plays favorites with those who have placed their
>faith in Christ, we read...
>
>Ephesians 1:3
>"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed
us
>with ALL spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:"
>
>Did you get that? "...ALL spiritual blessing..."
>
>Does God play 'favorites'? No doubt about it. But remember, He ALSO gives
>those who do not want any part of Him EXACTLY what they want. Peter is one
>such person. And he will get what he wants, we read...
>
>2 Timothy 4:14-15
>14 Alexander the coppersmith (Read: Peter the Bible beater...) did me much
>evil: the Lord reward him according to his works:
>15 Of whom be thou ware also; for he hath greatly withstood our words.
>
>There's your FAVORITE word again troll boy, 'reward'. And you'll no doubt
>blather away that God gives some kind of 'positive' reward away to those
who
>do evil, as if it were true because 'you' said so.
>
>Remember those days Alan? Remember when you tried in vain to 'teach' us
>that God, according to Proverbs, 'rewards' evil? Man, that was something.
Alan:
>>Which of course is another thing that the bible says God does,
>>play favorites. Imagine doing this to your children?
Apologist:
>God plays 'favorites'. I admit it. My children are Saved, thus they are
>safe in His hands. Hands that we cannot ever fall from, we read...
>
>John 10:29
>"My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to
>pluck them out of my Father's hand."
>
>...and...
>
>Romans 8:38-39
>38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor
>principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
>39 Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate
>us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
>
>Nothing can separate my family and myself from the Love of God and Eternal
>Salvation in His Presence.
Alan:
>>I am not out of line with a comment that this is very very sick!
Apologist:
>At the moment, you are very sick. You need Christ, or counseling, but
first
>and foremost, get Christ. Paul said...
>
>1 Corinthians 2:2
>"For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and
>him crucified."
Alan:
>>And I worry about you promoting this onto a very unsuspecting world!
Apologist:
>Oh please. All that coming from a man who is an admitted schizophrenic,
has
>imaginary students, has no trust in a God that created him with the ability
>to choose, and so on. All this from you, and you question me.
>
>Puh-leeze!
>
>Read this post thoroughly, maybe something will click for you.
>
>Dave...