(Ron) Natural Man

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>ACHILLES

>Again I follow you, but only to a point. In particular the assumption 

that

>"An atheist... is the perfect example of the "naturalistic"

>(soulish/intellectual)  extreme, the supernatural component being 

subdued

>and ruled by the  carnal/intellectual part" conflicts directly with the

>facts. There are a great many very devout and spiritual monastic 

Buddhists,

>for example, who are indeed atheists. 

>The trouble you are running into and will continue to run trying to 

support

>your position with this sort of argument is simply that you presume 

that

>all

>religious people follow your xtian theology. This is simply not true. 

The

>followers of YHVH all totalled (all the various branches of Judaism,

>Xtianity, Islam, and Mormon) are definately a sizable portion of the 

worlds

>religious/spiritual population - but equally certainly they are not 

even

>close to the totality. There are also adherents to entirely different

>theologies, and yes even atheists, who practice this spirituality you

>suppose to support your theology, and only your theology. 

>

>

RON
  Well, obviously we can't all be right. Either one of us has the 
correct understanding and all the rest are simply wrong, or we are all 
wrong. I, of course, believe I am right or I would change my beliefs. To 
understand my answer to the Buddhist "spirituality" you must understand 
my present view of the human (Scriptural) being. We are composed of the 
flesh or Body, the Soul (the life-force, which is immortal in humans. 
Containing the intellectual/psychological component) which is both 
spiritual and material, and the Spirit (the point within the center of 
our being which has contact with God). Other Christians may achieve 
contemplation or commune with God, whether they understand the process 
or not. Some practices, such as meditation upon Scripture or prayer may 
lead naturally to a receptive state, or God may simply choose to contact 
them. Of course many may delude themselves into thinking this has taken 
place when in reality it is nothing but immagination or demonic 
deception (this is where spiritual direction and a healthy scepticism is 
valuable). 
  I believe the Buddhist enlightenment is nothing more than an increased 
soulish/intellectual consciousness. Since for them the "spiritual" is a 
part of the illusory "natural" realm, I doubt that they would consider 
contact with gods or buddhas to be on the same par with the goal of 
enlightenment.  

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