Hitler & Stalin & Tung

yoel haalmoni (core@rof.net)
Tue, 1 Apr 1997 05:30:33 -0700 (MST)

>> WALT, JR 3/31
>> >Just as the actions of Hitler and Stalin and Tung is a reminder to people
>> >who take atheism seriously. Sorry Ralph, but your logic is really bad
>> >here. For you to connect people of faith universally with the Heaven's
>> >Gate group is equivalent to me connecting all atheists with the likes of
>> >Hitler and Stalin. How about we try to use our minds a little better than
>> >that?
>> >
>> >His,
>> >Walt Jr.
>
>(Christ-Ian 3/31) Walt Jr., Not only was Hitler a Catholic, Pope Pius XII gave
>silent approval to Hitler's plan to exterminate the Jews.
>
>As far as people of faith go, I have yet to see a Christian die as happy
>as the
>Heaven's Gate group.
>
>(DAVe 3/31) Ian: How about Stalin? Can you connect him to Christianity
>too? I'm sure there is a way to do it. Can't wait to see what you come up
>with. Oh yes, and Tung. They MUST have talked to a Christian at some time
>- that must qualify them eh?

yoel-
Stalin was not a skeptic- He believed in the supernatural. He consulted
psychics and astrologers. Also, there are atheists and there are atheists.

There are non believing people who simply do not believe in a god, but have
never questioned belief. Then there are people who know what one sacrifices
in order to belief in a god, that is, honesty and integrity and who reject
the self deception which is a prerequisite to the acceptence of any
religion. Neither of these positions claims a standard for absolute
morality nor is either of them a guarantee for personal integrity.

There is no consensus on atheism, just people lacking in belief- some
knowledgable of the pitfalls of religion and some unknowledgable. Some
stable, some unstable. Some unbelievers have never even considered the
issue of religion... they simply do not believe.

Contrary to what Christians like to believe, atheism is not an entity, and
it does not preach a "higher absolute morality". Christianity most
certainly does.

Neither do atheists claim to have "God's Spirit" dwelling in them as
Christians do.

And forget Mao and Stalin... Look at the atheists and Christians on this
list. You believe in Hell for those with ideas concerning God which differ
from yours. Walt Jr. believes in this Hell.
McDonald believes in this Hell.
Darrell doesn't.
Sarah doesn't.
I don't.
Even the nicest of literalist Christians bear in their belief system the
seeds of arrogance and attrocity.

As Jason Valentine, Hitler was not an atheist... he was a Christian. What
seems so contrary about Stalin and Tung is that in spite of their atheism
they were surprisingly Christ-like.

yoel